Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 11:29:08 GMT
Here is a biography/testimony by a man who, just like me, became a committed convert to Evangelical Christianity, only to leave it behind after a very exhaustive study of the history of Christianity.
However there is great difference between him and me, in that his studies ultimately led him to putting his weight behind the Orthodox Church.
But he does recognised my alternative direction at the end of his article when, in the section entitled “A TIME TO DECIDE”, he states “It is amazing how some of the most ‘conservative’ Bible scholars of the evangelical community turn into cynical and rationalistic liberals when discussing early Church history!"
Doubtless none of you will bother to read such an exhaustive and lengthy article …. but then I’m well experienced at “pissing against the wind”
www.protomartyr.org/our-faith/which-came-first-the-church-or-the-new-testament/
|
|
|
|
Post by amadeus on Apr 9, 2017 15:06:06 GMT
"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12
That verse is the answer to your seeming quandary, Mike. Many Christians get themselves into trouble in the same way that some scientists do. They presume that if they study the matter deeply enough they will obtain the answer they desire. Not so... Rather, they will move into, or deeper into, the confusion where men have been since the first disobedience occurred in Eden. The only way out is through Jesus. Study alone will not get us there, not by the best and finest scientists or theologians. The answer is here certainly, but I do not expect you to understand it:
"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26
People, good Christians in a measure will go back to this verse and misunderstand its meaning:
"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." II Tim 2:15
Study is requested and demanded but as means of understanding God or His Way. Rather the study is first a matter of obedience to eat the "flesh" of Jesus. Eating that flesh alone will get us no where without the Holy Ghost.
"Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life." II Cor 3:6
The spirit is the Holy Spirit or the Holy Ghost. A man can read and study the Bible until he can quote every verse and still be effectively dead in the eyes of God. We must have some that only comes from the Holy Ghost for the study to be brought to Life in us:
"Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled." Matt 5:6
That hunger and thirst is what is needed. Go to understanding what such a hunger and thirst is and how one obtains or receives it...
|
|
|
|
Post by Helen on Apr 9, 2017 15:20:51 GMT
I did read it all the way through...phew...some lengthy read!!!
He wrote well 'on the natural side' but like so many, he sees the bible as some kind of text book.
Some people care too much about ' this question or that question' ....to me , the only thing the bible is for, is to SPEAK TO ME. ( God using it as a vessel of communication'
Other than that I just dont care. People get themselves tied in knots when they care too much about who wrote it and when it was written.
I know that I have said so often....The bible is a spiritual book , so can only be understood spiritually. The problem is for many people, the natural mind gets in their way. I am very lucky as God did not give me a very big brain!! 
It is only when people start dissecting the bible that they get into trouble.
But , he wrote well...and I was interested and always am ,when a Jew comes to Christ. ✝️
|
|
|
|
Post by ivor on Apr 9, 2017 15:33:26 GMT
Sorry Mike, I only speak bible and to reply in bible about this issue or any issue of yours would obviously be pointless.
You choose whatever you do in your life Mike because God created you with a free will that's yours to use.... but me and my family for our part we will continue to surrender ourselves to Jesus our king and persevere with the bible and sharing it daily with my brothers and sisters in my life and on this forum who do similar.
If us doing so is really that offensive then please be careful that you don't let the door hit you in the back as you close it behind you. I do pray for you Mike and wish you genuine happiness in that place you choose to go to. It's my "time to decide" like your heading and after prayerful consideration I wont be answering directly to you again.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 16:41:46 GMT
It's my "time to decide" like your heading and after prayerful consideration I wont be answering directly to you again.
|
|
|
|
Post by Poppy on Apr 9, 2017 16:55:29 GMT
There are lots of books which can give us information, but only the Bible can bring about the transformation that is needed to please God. And that is because its words are inspired by God's Holy Spirit and to paraphrase Helen, you can know it inside out and upside down put until the Holy Spirit plants it into your heart it is just words. It only bring life to the reader when it is read as spiritual food and drink for the soul. For people to quote it without believing it to be God's word is a waste of time.
|
|
|
|
Post by james on Apr 9, 2017 17:05:21 GMT
I do not understand why a person would feel that to join this denomination or that denomination would make them a better christian, the church is those circumcised in the heart.
I was glad he had no problem with man writing as inspired by the spirit of God. What I did appreciate was the fact that he acknowledged the N.T. was written with out collaboration this makes evident the amazing hand of God as truth after truth is confirmed by the multitude of councillors/ Authors as the many books are brought together.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Apr 9, 2017 17:42:57 GMT
As one who did not read; it was the "exhaustive" that put me off. But I did read " a committed convert to evangelical Christianity" a wrong commitment right there; the simple commitment is as the master said, "Come follow me" which is neither lengthy or exhaustive.
|
|
|
|
Post by Poppy on Apr 9, 2017 18:07:16 GMT
... or denominational.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 21:50:17 GMT
Poppy, I'm not sure whether that means that you must have read, or must not have read the following extract from the article:-
"I believed that those who were truly faithful and honest in following this principle would achieve Christian unity. To my surprise, this “common sense” approach led not to increased Christian clarity and unity, but rather to a spiritual free-for-all! Those who most strongly adhered to believing “only the Bible” tended to become the, most factious, divisive, and combative of Christians-perhaps unintentionally.
In fact, it seemed to me that the more one held to the Bible as the only source of spiritual authority, the more factious and sectarian one became. We would even argue heatedly over verses on love!
Within my circle of Bible-believing friends, I witnessed a mini-explosion of sects and schismatic movements, each claiming to be “true to the Bible” and each in bitter conflict with the others.
Serious conflict arose over every issue imaginable: charismatic gifts, interpretation of prophecy, the proper way to worship, communion, Church government, discipleship, discipline in the Church, morality, accountability, evangelism, social action, the relationship of faith and works, the role of women, and ecumenism.
The list is endless. In fact any issue at all could-and often did-cause Christians to part ways. The fruit of this sectarian spirit has been the creation of literally thousands of independent churches and denominations"
|
|
|
|
Post by Helen on Apr 10, 2017 0:04:32 GMT
Facts are facts...and in many decades of walking with the Lord...that does prove true.
That is why, in our personally circle of friends and family we use the term..." ...but this is not a beach to die on...". To me the big issue is never right or wrong...because until God rolls up the carpet, we cannot be 100% sure on which side of the argument the truth falls. So the issue always is RELATIONSHIP... those who split and start new denominations did not value the relationship above their own persuasion of what is truth.
Whenever I can, I will always choose to stay in fellowship ...unless the other person breaks the fellowship. Some always will, some are mature enough to just " agree to differ" .
Obviously Peter and Paul could not team up and work together...they chose to take a different companion on their preaching trips. Yet the Word itself was not divided. They just wrote their epistles from different perspectives...and as we have seen...God blessed their works.
|
|
|
|
Post by ivor on Apr 10, 2017 1:00:34 GMT
There is unity with the brethren that is why we cry out Amen when God speaks through any of them but the wheat and tares grow together and as anyone with a garden will know - the weeds rule and overpower the wheat but one day soon the gardener will return and the weeds will be removed and then the wheat will get a clearer view of all those many millions of faithful ones who stood the test of time and Weed ruler-ship
|
|
